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Spec = I run away & dont bid
06-27-2013, 12:36 PM, (This post was last modified: 06-27-2013, 01:14 PM by eaadams.)
#1
Spec = I run away & dont bid
I got a kick out of this spec. Talk about unrealistic.

enjoy.....


1.9 WARRANTY
A. Provide manufacturer's written guarantee barrier's performance shall produce a water vapor emission result not to exceed 2.5 (±0.5} pounds per 1,000 square feet per ASTM F1869 prior to installation of floor coverings. Substrates exceeding specified requirement shall be resealed at no cost to Owner.
1. Substrates exceeding specified requirement shall be resealed at no cost to Owner.
2. In the event floor coverings are damaged and independent testing results verify a water vapor emission and alkalinity values, manufacturer and installer shall repair or replace barrier, floor coverings, adhesives and patching compounds at no cost to Owner. Warranty shall not list upper moisture or alkalinity levels. Warranty shall not exclude cracks, concrete cohesive failure, ACI 318, ACI 201, dew point, concrete salts or silicates contamination.

B. Product liability insurance in the amount of $6,000,000 per occurrence listing Architect, and Owner as additional insured. Sub-contractor general liability certificates are not acceptable.

PART 2- PRODUCTS
2.1 MANUFACTURERS
A. Description: Two-Component, spray applied product for application to newly poured concrete slabs on grade during final troweling process and designed to suppress water vapor mission,
alkalinity, and relative humidity rates from concrete. Material shall be a polymer (non-silicate) based penetrating, film forming barrier that remains compatible with flooring adhesives.

1. Basis of Design: Drawings and specifications are based on the following:
a. Synthetics International; Synthetic 10 TR.
2. Subject to compliance with requirements, provide products indicated or equal products byone of the following:
a. Diamond Stone Products
b. Ardex Moisture Control

2.2 PHYSICAL PROPERTIES
A. Barrier shall meet or exceed the following:
1. Product
Product Color:Clear or white
Material Mixture:Two-component
Product TypeTongueenetrating water-based polymer with crack resistance
Thickness:8-15 mills, WFT
Number of Coats:Two-coat process
Solid Content:25 to 50 percent by volume
Spread Rate:Two coats/ 250 square feet per gallon
Flooring Ready:12-24 hours
i. Foot Traffic:8-12 hours
j. Product Odor:Slight odor
k. Environmental:Non-corrosive, water based, water clean up product

2. Performance
a. Vapor Reduction:95 percent vapor reduction
b. Alkali Resistance:Resistance to 30 day exposure to 14 pH in accordance with ASTM 01308
c. Alkali Resistance:35 percent potassium hydroxide resistant in accordance with ASTM 01308
d. VOC Content:50 -65 g/liter per EPA Method 24
e. Concrete Adhesion:600 psi or concrete cohesive failure in accordance with ASTM FD4541
f. Relative Humidity:Suppress 100 percent RH in accordance with ASTM F2170
g. Moisture Emission:Results in a 2.0- 2.5 pounds emission in accordance with ASTM F1869
h. Alkalinity Control:Suppress 12.5 to 14 pH without damage

Oh and I didn't get to the end:
B. Areas above flooring tolerance of 3.0 pounds in accordance with ASTM F1869 are to be resealed at no cost to Owner.
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06-30-2013, 04:27 PM,
#2
RE: Spec = I run away & dont bid
Whoever prepared this is absolutely clueless.Huh You're right, I got a laugh out of this one.Big Grin Thanks for sharing!
JK Nixon
Concrete Restoration Services, LLC
Pittsburgh, PA
http://www.rhtester.com
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07-02-2013, 08:26 AM, (This post was last modified: 07-02-2013, 08:28 AM by CC Solutions.)
#3
RE: Spec = I run away & dont bid
Who wrote that spec??? Exclamation

It contradicts itself over and over! Sprayed on and troweled in, yet put on at 8-15 mils??? Flooring ready in 12 hours but troweled in?

And the mitigation has to not only provide a warranty for reducing the MVER and alkalinity, but a performance bond guaranteeing the concrete won't crack or delaminate?

You know what this is.... A project manager went through a few spec sheets and took verbiage from several manufacturers then shot for the moon and asked for a performance bond and a load of guarantees.

And you know what? Someone will bid it, bid it really low and get the job, then the thing will fail and they will walk away.

THAT is one guarantee I will stand by..... Wink

(06-27-2013, 12:36 PM)eaadams Wrote:  I got a kick out of this spec. Talk about unrealistic.


2. Subject to compliance with requirements, provide products indicated or equal products byone of the following:
a. Diamond Stone Products
b. Ardex Moisture Control


And Ardex would just LAUGH at this!!!
JD Grafton
Concrete Answers for Flooring Problems
[email protected]
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07-02-2013, 08:52 AM,
#4
RE: Spec = I run away & dont bid
It is one of the largest school architects in California. I've tried to service them and give them my best advice but they refuse to listen.

Now we are choosing to pass on bidding this project, we don't want to mess with flooring on whatever 'that' is up above. Simply too much liability.

I suspect the spec was written by one of the manufacturers & I can guarantee it wasn't Ardex.
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07-02-2013, 09:45 AM,
#5
RE: Spec = I run away & dont bid
What was that Forrest Gump said? "stupid is as stupid does"
JK Nixon
Concrete Restoration Services, LLC
Pittsburgh, PA
http://www.rhtester.com
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07-02-2013, 10:27 AM,
#6
RE: Spec = I run away & dont bid
(06-27-2013, 12:36 PM)eaadams Wrote:  Product liability insurance in the amount of $6,000,000 per occurrence...

I just talked to my insurance. This requirement alone would cost me an extra $4,000 per year.

Glad I ran from this spec.

What do you all carry for Product Liability insurance?
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07-02-2013, 10:29 AM,
#7
RE: Spec = I run away & dont bid
Just roll it into the job bid. They asked for it, let them pay it.

But the spec is impossible, so it's kind of a moot point.
JD Grafton
Concrete Answers for Flooring Problems
[email protected]
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07-02-2013, 10:35 AM,
#8
RE: Spec = I run away & dont bid
There is no way the 'low bidder' would catch that cost. They would low bid, win, do work, and just get their pay put on hold till they complied with insurance requirements.
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07-02-2013, 11:15 AM,
#9
RE: Spec = I run away & dont bid
Kinda like walking into a spinning propeller wouldn't you say?
JK Nixon
Concrete Restoration Services, LLC
Pittsburgh, PA
http://www.rhtester.com
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07-02-2013, 11:17 AM,
#10
RE: Spec = I run away & dont bid
With that I would only loose a leg.

On this job I'd loose my nuts.
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