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Concrete floor and laminate
03-31-2011, 12:08 PM (This post was last modified: 03-31-2011 12:12 PM by CC Solutions.)
Post: #41
RE: Concrete floor and laminate
Morrisey,
You seem to have an unlimited supply of moisture to your floor. In this type of situation, only a system that has unlimited coverage will be guaranteed. You should get this in writing from the manufacturer. While Ardex has systems that will handle 90% easily, your floor can exceed that amount. Ardex MC may be a possibility, but it is not warranted to 100% RH. Ardex may write you a letter extending the warranty to 100% if you ask though. MC is a wonderful product (I am certified for MC) or you could use another product, again looking at a warranty covering 100%RH and unlimited alkalinity.
(03-28-2011 09:14 PM)eaadams Wrote:  What is the ardex definition of "dry substrate"?

90% 85% 80% 75%
15# 10# 5# 3#

This is determined by the flooring manufacturer. If the requirements are 75% RH then 80% is not dry. If the requirement is 85% RH then 80% is dry. Of course all manufacturers will reference ASTM F710 which then requires a proper and working vapor retarder. If the floor is receiving moisture from below, all bets are off and your warranty is void.

JD Grafton
Concrete Answers for Flooring Problems
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03-31-2011, 12:16 PM
Post: #42
RE: Concrete floor and laminate
I haven't been around long enough to remember but there are lots of slabs that had asbestos flooring used over pretty wet slabs. What did they use to feather with back then?
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03-31-2011, 12:16 PM (This post was last modified: 03-31-2011 12:19 PM by CC Solutions.)
Post: #43
RE: Concrete floor and laminate
(03-28-2011 09:22 PM)Ernesto Wrote:  My question pertains to the use of patching/slc's under moisture cure urethane/s and newer adhesives that block moisture and is the adhesive as well.

Wouldn't it not be just like covering it with a moisture mitigation system? Same as using MVP4 over top of the patch or slc and then gluing wood, vinyl or what have you over it?

I have gotten mixed directives from different manufacturers about this. One wants it under the mitigation systen, other want the patch/slc on top. But I have a had tome envisioning the patch or slc sticking to the mitigation system.

Most patch manufacturers will default to the flooring manufacturer's requirements for level of dryness in the slab. Therefore if the slab is dry enough for flooring, the patch is fine. If the moisture is too high, the patch should not go down.

Patch and SLU's stick to moisture systems by using a primer or an aggregate applied to the mitigation system when it is wet. These work very well! I have tested them with an Elcometer and found they will sometimes be stronger than the concrete substrate, but always at least 300 psi tensile.

(03-31-2011 12:16 PM)eaadams Wrote:  I haven't been around long enough to remember but there are lots of slabs that had asbestos flooring used over pretty wet slabs. What did they use to feather with back then?

There's a lot of Feather Finish on those floors! If the flooring breathes like VAT or ceramic, the patch will be okay. It's when the moisture gets trapped that you have a problem!

Just soak some Feather Finish with water and scrape your finger nail over it.... It turns to goo. Wet feather doesn't hold up to rolling loads or tensile forces.

JD Grafton
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03-31-2011, 06:46 PM (This post was last modified: 03-31-2011 06:54 PM by Ernesto.)
Post: #44
RE: Concrete floor and laminate
I recall talking to the Ardex tech dept a couple years ago about using feather finish on top of cutbac adhesive with a moisture cure urethane over top of it. They said no problemo. Thats for a engineered wood floor over top. Does a wood floor with that adhesive breathe enough? But my main concern then was the feather finishes ability to hold a bond to the cutbac residue and moisture cure urethane with the movement of the wood


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Stephen Perrera dba
Top Floor Installation Co.
http://www.tucsonazflooring.com
http://www.floorsavior.com
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03-31-2011, 07:02 PM
Post: #45
RE: Concrete floor and laminate
(03-31-2011 06:46 PM)Ernesto Wrote:  I recall talking to the Ardex tech dept a couple years ago about using feather finish on top of cutbac adhesive with a moisture cure urethane over top of it. They said no problemo. Thats for a engineered wood floor over top. Does a wood floor with that adhesive breathe enough? But my main concern then was the feather finishes ability to hold a bond to the cutbac residue and moisture cure urethane with the movement of the wood


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Ardex will say no problem. But if the moisture is high enough to damage the Feather Finish guess what they will say then?

There are very specific parameters for using any product. Sure you can put a patch on concrete and then put a sealer on it or cover it with rubber flooring. But if the concrete is too wet or becomes too wet, the patch will fail and there is no warranty.

This is the type of thing I deal with daily, failures when people thought it would be okay, and thought a manufacturer approved a procedure, but they find out there's circumstances that won't be warranted. Any manufacturer will guarantee their product will work as long as everything is correct.

JD Grafton
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04-01-2011, 06:53 AM
Post: #46
RE: Concrete floor and laminate
I don't believe there is anything 100%.Show me the puddin.Big Grin

Stephen Perrera dba
Top Floor Installation Co.
http://www.tucsonazflooring.com
http://www.floorsavior.com
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04-01-2011, 07:56 AM
Post: #47
RE: Concrete floor and laminate
(04-01-2011 06:53 AM)Ernesto Wrote:  I don't believe there is anything 100%.Show me the puddin.Big Grin

Like I said, Ardex may warrant 100% if you ask and they inspect the installation.

Koester warrants 100% and unlimited RH every day.

The KEY to any of these systems when pushed to the max is proper preparation.

JD Grafton
Concrete Answers for Flooring Problems
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